r/WhitePeopleTwitter Aug 17 '22 Helpful 1 Silver 2

Holy Fucking Shit Indeed

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65.3k Upvotes

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u/Cymen90 Aug 17 '22 edited Aug 17 '22 Gold Helpful

German here. Not only do we read the Diary but we also get to visit Concentation-Camps for our school-trips.

Trust me, seeing the ovens of Mittelbau Dora for yourself is different from pictures. Then they took us behind the furnace house where the Nazis had dumped the ashes of thousands. I will never forget how different the grass and the moss looked from every other spot.

It is where they were building the "Vergeltungswaffe 2" AKA the V2 Rocket, the most advanced ballistic missile back then. The same tech that, after being confiscated during the camp's liberation, would enable America to land on the moon years later.

And then there was....the tunnel. I think of it sometimes still.

More info on the camp here.

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u/ParmesanNonGrata Aug 17 '22

Thanks for chiming in with so many sources. These wimps pissing their pants over Anne Frank's diary... The kind of shit we had to read, see and visit before we were even 16 haunt me to this day.

As. It. Should.

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u/Sohjinn Aug 17 '22

Don’t mistake America’s banning of it being fueled by fear of it. It’s all about control.

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u/CopprRegendt Aug 17 '22

Destroying education is a main piller of fascism. Remove all anti-fascist sources and stories of fascism in history from education and grow a generation of dumb, ignorant sheeple who believe whatever propeganda you feed them and fight whatever fights you tell them they should fight for.

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u/No_Construction_7518 Aug 18 '22

It's because those banning the books want history to repeat itself.

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u/ParmesanNonGrata Aug 17 '22

Of course.

Fascists gonna fascist.

It's just in times like these this argument is even more stupid then usually because good grief, these people are in dire need of education and appreciation for the seriousness of what happened.

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u/Starryskies117 Aug 18 '22

America as a whole didn't ban it from schools. One dumbass district in Texas banned it in their schools.

Still awful it's banned anywhere though.

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u/Sohjinn Aug 18 '22

Yeah, I should have specified, I didn’t mean ‘America’ as a whole banned it. It’s ridiculous that it’s allowed to be banned anywhere, though

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u/ComfyFrog Aug 17 '22

I attended a school in Germany called Anne Frank Schule....

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u/crisis_in_the_makin Aug 17 '22

That sounds like the right thing to do.

Wish we were more poignant about our atrocities. From treatment of native Americans to Black communities and Japanese. I WANT my kids to learn about this stuff. So we do not repeat it.

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u/N0kiaoff Aug 18 '22

I WANT my kids to learn about this stuff. So we do not repeat it.

---

German here. Not arguing, just my (ok, long) thoughts as an addition:

Germany got do exist in this modern Europe today because we were given the chance to cooperate with neighbors.

And it entails admitting historical facts about wrong doings, not hiding (aka "was not me"/my generation), but documenting & taking responsibility, working on them (with survivors and their ancestors), and not get confused by pride over facts.

National pride can easily lead to ignoring dark aspects of past or current societies. Being "accountable" in a group and documenting it with cooperation with others ensures peace in its own way.

The is no "shame" in admitting that your grandpa or his generation were wrong and committed crimes. am just sad, that he never faces trial.

What i have to note though: trump rallies back in the day with "lock her up" choruses and waving flags where copied from german rallies. They called for extrajudicial punishment. And somehow that was ok and allowed at both times.

When german Nazis took power, they already dragged all Social and liberal politicians out of parliament into non or semi legal prisoner camps and had Justices replaced to make it legal after the fact.

What happened on 6.1. in US was maybe way less organized, but not less dangerous, because if they could have, some politicians would have been lynched by a mob who could later claim to be "the people".

I just feel responsible in the same way you stated: Never again

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u/Encrux615 Aug 17 '22

I've been to Dachau. It was bad enough reading and listening to all the individual stories.

But ho-ly-fu-ck Auschwitz is on another level entirely. The vastness of the barracks inmates "lived" in. The gas Chambers. The walls where people got executed. And the worst part, in my opinion, was a showcase of all the things Nazis collected from inmates. Valuables, gold teeth and the most damning showcase: literal human hair. That was hard even for someone who doesn't feel too much in places like this.

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u/LOR_Fei Aug 18 '22

American Jew here.

In the summer going to my senior year of High School, I went on a trip to Poland and Israel. We went to Poland to go visit the concentration camps.

In high school I was a fairly chatty guy, but I couldn’t say a word in Birkenau. The place is left in roughly the same shape as it was after the war, with exception of a few shoe areas which are haunting in person. Everything about it was horrific.

Auschwitz was different. The whole place felt more like a tourist destination, the tour guides walked around like we were in a museum, where many areas were made like a meuseum of nature & science with display cases. Having just been to Birkenau, it felt grotesque to have a concentration camp set up like this. It took away the impact and raw emotion I felt and traded it with the feeling of commercialism.

It grew me as a person to go, but it still haunts me. If you visit Poland, Birkenau may change you and is worth a visit.

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u/DebentureThyme Aug 17 '22 edited Aug 17 '22

I had someone here in the US recently try to "Both Sides" me about Neo-Nazis; They claimed that the "worst fascist in recent history was a socialist" and that the most dangerous Neo-Nazi sects today are liberal/socialist. They could not be convinced that Hitler wasn't actually a socialist, because it fit their narrative to hate on anyone left of center politically.

That's how bad education has fallen. This both sides, alternative facts garbage has them believing whatever is convenient today - in this case allowing them to deflect that basically every Neo-Nazi in the US firmly supports one party. And this will all trickle down to muddy up actual historical record when they teach their kids to debate well-corroborated historical record.

They take "history is written by the victors" and turned it on it's edge to deny well sourced historical record that is undeniable in it's breadth and depth.

I don't even blame the teachers. You've got parents and politicians in certain states tying their hands about what can be taught. Teaching of what happened in World War 2, and how it reached that point, is vital to avoiding another Hitler. Teaching how he joined the National Socialists only to use them to take over - and how the actual socialists were some of the first on his chopping block - is vital to understanding the point of how he was able to take hold.

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u/Railboy Aug 17 '22

I don't even blame the teachers. You've got parents and politicians in certain states tying their hands about what can be taught.

Exactly - it's a mistake to say education has failed here because these ideas and facts were carefully and deliberately dismantled.

I saw these both sides arguments take root in mainstream thinking over the course of several years and foolishly thought nobody would be stupid and/or ignorant enough to believe them. Some of the people who parrot them are both, but the ones doing the heavy lifting know they're full of shit and just don't care.

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u/CopprRegendt Aug 17 '22

Do you see the shoes, or any other piles of items taken from Jews? There's a Holocaust Museum in Washington, DC, USA, and people who go say that there's a room lined with shelves of shoes taken from Jews and it's usually what does people in. Names are names, people LIVE in their shoes.

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u/ghoti99 Aug 17 '22 Gold All-Seeing Upvote

If book banners could read they would be so offended by this tweet.

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u/TheProcrastafarian Aug 17 '22

I can just picture the replacement book. Von Maus und Untermensch

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u/TBANON_NSFW Aug 17 '22

You keep laughing at them.

They show up to vote and join school boards, homeowner associations, city management groups and then begin to reduce rights and protections to ensure they gain more gradual control of the various means of government.

They reduce education accessibility, lower funds for education remove requirements to teach to ensure more right-wing propaganda and ethnocentric religiously motivated indoctrination is taught to ensure future control, While you laugh at them and call them dumb and stupid.

They pass laws that force women to give birth and carry dead fetuses and embryos that endanger their lives. Forced to carry their rapists child while you laugh at them and call them dumb.

They threaten and attack the last pillars of democracy and try to force via violence hatred and intimidation their goals of your subservience, While you laugh at them and call them dumb and stupid.

They show up they vote they get engaged to ensure they take more and more step by step until you wake up one day to a world you never imagined was possible in this day and age, starting to round up undesirables and those they deem not as worthy as them.

I wonder if you would keep laughing at them and call them stupid and dumb as you see neighbour by neighbour family members become victims to their rhetoric and ideology?

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u/ghoti99 Aug 17 '22 edited Aug 17 '22

To be fair determination, intelligence, and wisdom are neither welded together nor are they mutually exclusive. Historically speaking fascism has failed violently in every society that has a record of attempting it. We’re stupid enough to be trying it roughly a dozen times within a hundred year period so maybe we’re all kinda dumb? I dunno.

What I do know is this: the world never stops turning, and the future isn’t set, but if you think a word without laughter has any chance of stopping the rising tide of fascism, then I feel sorry for you and your limited world view.

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u/DependentFamous5252 Aug 17 '22

Hahaha. Good point. But no one ever taught them. Have some sympathy.

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u/molotovzav Aug 17 '22

When I was a kid (8th gradeish, so tween to teen actually), this is America keep in mind, we read the unabridged diary of Anne frank. This was a big deal as many of our parents read the abridged version. We're going backwards. Though my state never was a big book banner, I'm glad they still aren't and became even more so against it.

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u/MikeThrowAway47 Aug 18 '22

The version being banned by one school district is a graphic novel adaptation of Anne Frank’s “The Diary of a Young Girl.”

https://www.amazon.com/Anne-Franks-Diary-Adaptation-Pantheon/dp/1101871792

It’s like an uber-abridged graphic comic. I think the purpose of the adaptation is to share her story with a younger audience. And kudos for that! However, they did include Franks musings on sexuality. And that’s why it’s being banned.

This school district asked parents to submit recommendations on books to ban. One smart parent submitted the Bible because it contains, “Inappropriate content including: Sexual content, violence including rape, murder, human sacrifice, misogyny, homophobia, discrimination, and other inappropriate content.”

More info here:

https://nypost.com/2022/08/17/bible-among-controversial-books-banned-by-dallas-area-school-district/

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/17/us/texas-school-books-removed-bible.html

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u/I_Do_Not_Abbreviate Aug 18 '22

One smart parent submitted the Bible

That parent definitely used to watch Doctor Quinn: Medicine Woman as a kid:

Season 3, Episode 5: "The Library"
Mrs. Quinn sends her husband's books out to Dr. Mike, and Dr. Mike decides to start a town library with them. Others in town find some of the books inappropriate for people to read, including some of the classic novels. The town council tries to close the library, and even burns a few books. Things change when Dr. Mike brings a Bible into church, points out that it has many of the things they find as objectionable reading material without telling them what book it is. After she hands it to the Reverend, she tells the congregation that it's "the Holy Bible."

The final scene of the episode is a reveal that the biggest anti-book guy (who spoke out against the library, who riled up everyone else, who actually dumped the books into a pile and set them alight) is illiterate; the episode ends with him being taught how to read by one of the town schoolkids who can.

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u/xdc020 Aug 17 '22

I don't think the reason is "handling it" some how...

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u/LiminalArtsAndMusic Aug 17 '22

Can't have the next reign of fascism if people can readily identify and stomp out fascism

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u/xdc020 Aug 17 '22

Educated serfs are dangerous. More religion please.

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u/Context__Matters Aug 17 '22

Jesus saves

At his local Walmart

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u/Mrsynthpants Aug 17 '22 edited Aug 17 '22

Jesus saves! Gretzky scores!

The workers slave. The rich get more.

One wrong move and we risk the cup.

So play The Man, not the puck.

  • Propagandhi

Edit: formatting

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u/terpterpin Aug 17 '22

As an interpreter my mind just exploded looking at this. As a human I laughed my ass off.

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u/HyFinated Aug 17 '22

More like, "Jesus saves, conservatives withdraw"

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u/teknomanzer Aug 17 '22

Marx was mistaken when he called religion the opiate of the masses... only because he had not heard of "bath salts" in his day.

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u/Grimvahl Aug 17 '22

You hit it on the head here! Christian Nationalist is just another word for Nazis. Fuck facists.

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u/Nix-7c0 Aug 17 '22 edited Aug 17 '22

No no no, fascism is when a private company won't build me a microphone to send threats, slander, and medical misinformation across the globe! If every single online space for discussion doesn't look like 4chan's worst and darkest corners, it's literally 1984!

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u/LateNightPhilosopher Aug 17 '22

I've been saying this for years in a more casual way. Many boomers seem quite surprised that Trumpism isn't more popular among the younger generations. But like THEY'RE the ones who raised us on Star Wars and Indiana Jones, the and Tolkien, and the literal motherfucking History Channel back when it actually had history documentaries.

They raised us steeped in media that taught us how to identify and resist the rise of fascism and other authoritarian ideologies. Why in the fuck would they ever assume that we'd magically just turn into boot lickers after spending our entire youths being warned against it???

I guess I shouldn't start giving them ideas though, or else they might try to ban Star Wars and Lord of the Rings too lol

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u/TheNewManRisen Aug 17 '22

Sadly this seems like a pretty likely reason in all reality

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u/jet_pack Aug 17 '22

People who support capitalism (i.e., the right-wing) can't identify or stomp out fascism, unfortunately.

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u/_BigChallenges Aug 17 '22

You mean they refuse to see themselves in the mirror?

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u/-TheKingInYellow- Aug 17 '22

They want kids dumber than they are.

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u/xdc020 Aug 17 '22

But but, teachers and universities are all full of God hating communists!

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u/-TheKingInYellow- Aug 17 '22

Only as long as they're alive. Eventually the final bumper crop of idiots will ensure academia is shuttered forever. Pass the Brawndo.

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u/xdc020 Aug 17 '22

I just hope I'm dead before that.

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u/PandaMuffin1 Aug 17 '22

Don't forget they are "groomers" and also want to make precious white children feel sad about history.

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u/vendetta2115 Aug 17 '22

The whole “groomer” thing came out so quickly and uniformly that there’s no way it wasn’t an organized effort. It’s just another recycled version of falsely associating the LGBT community with pedophilia, despite the majority of pedophiles being straight cis men.

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u/Professional_Band178 Aug 17 '22

The fact that drag queens aren't transgender seems to be lost on those idiots making the claim of grooming.

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u/xdc020 Aug 17 '22

They would hate my decolonised curriculum 😂

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u/vendetta2115 Aug 17 '22

The third characteristic of fascism out of fourteen that Umberto Eco outlines in his 1995 essay Ur Fascism touches on this exact point:

Irrationalism also depends on the cult of action for action's sake. Action being beautiful in itself, it must be taken before, or without, any previous reflection. Thinking is a form of emasculation. Therefore culture is suspect insofar as it is identified with critical attitudes. Distrust of the intellectual world has always been a symptom of Ur-Fascism, from Goering's alleged statement ("When I hear talk of culture I reach for my gun") to the frequent use of such expressions as "degenerate intellectuals," "eggheads," "effete snobs," "universities are a nest of reds." The official Fascist intellectuals were mainly engaged in attacking modern culture and the liberal intelligentsia for having betrayed traditional values.

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u/xdc020 Aug 17 '22

Phenomenal discussion of the issue, thanks for that. I will use this in my politics 101 unit this year. Brings in all kinds of connotations about intellectualism, progress and "wokeness" too and how these things are so threatening for the Right.

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u/Educational_Cat_5902 Aug 17 '22

Wait, are Republicans trying to ban Anne Frank now?

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u/guestpass127 Aug 17 '22 Silver

Yeah

Those brave first amendment defenders on the right are trying to ban books about fascism because they don’t want kids to be able to spot fascism

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u/CT_Jester Aug 17 '22

They banned 1984 for being "pro-communist" when the theme of the book is anti-authoritarian.

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u/Kitsune_Scribe Aug 17 '22

Ironically it lead 1984 to became a revitalized best hit.

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u/Ericrobertson1978 Aug 17 '22

It's hilarious to me when AltRight conservatives mistakingly think 1984 somehow supports their fascist bullshit.

It's literally about standing up against it.

Orwell was vociferously anti-fascist.

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u/Jkj864781 Aug 17 '22

These are the same people who listen to Rage Against the Machine and think they’re talking about lockdowns and TyRaNnY

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u/R-Van Aug 17 '22

Their favorite movie is probably 'American history X'...

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u/HeavySaucer Aug 17 '22

I love that movie. But probably not for the same reasons you're alluding to lol.

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u/Jkj864781 Aug 17 '22

They watched “Idiocracy” and thought it was a blueprint

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u/FalsePremise8290 Aug 17 '22

They think The Handmaid's Tale is Utopian Fiction.

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u/stormtrooper00 Aug 17 '22

Probably because the only thing they remember is “fuck you I won’t do what you told me”

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u/Jkj864781 Aug 17 '22

Literally the next line goes “some of those that work forces are the same that burn crosses” and their brain just goes “PuNiShEr LoGo”

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u/tsunamitom1- Aug 17 '22

RATM is my favorite conservative band. What do you mean they’re anti fascist? s/

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u/Dalriata Aug 17 '22

Most of society's actual best and brightest are some flavour of socialist or communist. No less a genius than Einstein him-fucking-self wrote an article in 1949 denouncing capitalism as a failure and warning against the future of private-controlled mass media.

I'm going to guess he would have been even more vocally, maybe even explicitly, a communist, if he weren't living through the absolute height of the red scare.

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u/kayama57 Aug 17 '22

I’ve had at least two unfortunately memorable conversations that started somewhere around a comment of mine similar to “this is right out 1984” and the next reply was “get that book out yo’ mouth boy we progressives in here”. People are wild and don’t know fuck about shit

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u/halloejsovs Aug 17 '22

Also the alt right fucks quoted it heavily not too many years ago everytime they cry abiut "muh globohomo", and "I can't say shit abiut the jews".

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u/permanentthrowaway42 Aug 17 '22

and why it featured the removal of language and words to stop people from articulating… “wrong-think”, like… Anne Frank

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u/svenson_26 Aug 17 '22

It was banned in the USSR for being anti-communist.

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u/watchingsongsDL Aug 17 '22 edited Aug 17 '22

Yeah labor was represented by the horse. He was eventually worked to death.

Edit: I am a dumbass. I confused 1984 with Animal Farm. The two short novels everyone read about Communism.

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u/TonyWrocks Aug 17 '22

Are you thinking of Animal Farm? I don't remember a horse in 1984, but it's been a long time since I read it.

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u/spiderlady16777216 Aug 17 '22

No horses in 1984. Boxer in Animal Farm was worked until seriously ill, told he was going to a hospital, and taken to a glue factory (glue used to be made from parts of dead horses).

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u/i-Ake Aug 17 '22

I haven't read that book since middle school and that was the reason why. I was absolutely devastated. Fuck those pigs.

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u/SlipperyRasputin Aug 17 '22

No that’s not it. 1984 is the sequel where the horse put his name into the goblet of fire

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u/qqqeqe Aug 17 '22

No that's not it. 1984 is the one where the horse shouts "You shall not pass!" in Moria.

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u/therealjoshua Aug 17 '22

This reminds me that I should re-read Animal Farm. Haven't read it since middle school.

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u/Tyler89558 Aug 17 '22

1984 was banned in both the US and the USSR for being pro and anti communist respectively

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u/NRMusicProject Aug 17 '22

I still remember something like 15 years ago some students were suspended for reading "communist propaganda" on the intercom. They were reading Orwell (can't remember if it was 1984 or Animal Farm).

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u/Cuboos Aug 17 '22

The "reasoning" is because there's a part in the book where Anne Frank talks about masturbating as a teenager. Which you know that's inappropriate to talk about and all, fair enough. But when we did Diary of Anne Frank in high school, we just skipped over that part. Not sure why the GOP can't just do that.

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u/Sadatori Aug 17 '22

Because the GOP are all or nothing on every issue they make up. I can’t think of one single thing the GOP has approached in a segmented way at all.

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u/corgioverthemoon Aug 17 '22

And also why is masturbation inappropriate as a teenager? I thought it's a completely normal thing that teens do.

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u/DragonflyGrrl Aug 17 '22

Of course it is. They're batshit crazy and love to damage kids. You know, cuz they love them so much.

But I should add, it wasn't just the masturbation. She talked about having a crush on another girl.

I know, horrible.

😡

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u/FalsePremise8290 Aug 17 '22

High schools have cellphones. That's literal porn in their pocket. The idea that mention of masturbation is too much for teens is laughable.

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u/Atrobbus Aug 17 '22

Anne Frank was a teenager herself when writing about masturbation. So this shows that it's clearly a normal thing for teens to think about.

Censoring this doesn't make these thoughts go away. The only thing it accomplishes is that it drives teens to secretly look up sexual questions online. without any guidance.

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u/mrmeowmeowington Aug 17 '22

And porn which lacks a lot of female pleasure:( . Not a great source to learn all your sexual information from. It should be normalized to discuss masterbation and sex. It’s not supposed to be a thing of shame. So much control.

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u/RobWroteABook Aug 17 '22

Imagine living in the universe where the group of people that howls about "cancel culture" every time a comedian gets a mean tweet is also the one trying to ban books because history makes them look bad.

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u/BlueBurstBoi Aug 17 '22

Gaslight Obstruct Project

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u/turdintheattic Aug 17 '22

It’s been banned by the district where I live for a few years now, guess it’s spreading.

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u/Educational_Cat_5902 Aug 17 '22

What fucking district do you live in??

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u/Sir_TonyStark Aug 17 '22

A backwards and ignorant one apparently

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u/3amhiccups Aug 17 '22

Yeah it grooms kids because she talks about puberty and having a gay crush in it. Also math books groom kids because math is liberal. Books groom kids we gotta outlaw books. All knowledge is grooming. Groom groom groom groom

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u/Educational_Cat_5902 Aug 17 '22

I completely forgot she had a gay crush.

Oh nooooo what are we gonna do?!! /s

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u/3amhiccups Aug 17 '22

CTR?!?!?! SOCIALISM REEEEEE

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u/Patient_Mixture9947 Aug 17 '22

Uhg. “Groom”. I hate that word. It’s a way for cowards to make a serious and heinous accusation without actually saying it, so there are no legal consequences for their libel. If you’re sure enough someone is a groomer to say it, you’re sure enough to call the cops.

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u/enfier Aug 17 '22

Just the graphic novel which adds back the parts her family removed about her being sexually attracted to another girl.

The actual book you read as a kid isn't being banned, it was just a bit sanitized which might be fair given that we write things in our diary that we might not care to be public.

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u/Coopermeister Aug 17 '22

Yup, and I’m not sure if it’s because they don’t like demonizing fascism, or it’s because she was potentially gay. Either way republicans are scum

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u/Wayte13 Aug 17 '22

Always have been

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u/ThisIsNotBenShapiro Aug 17 '22

Remarkably, the Christian Bible also got banned for explicit descriptions of rape and incest.

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u/PM_Me_Your_Sidepods Aug 17 '22

They already did.

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u/ILoveRegenHealth Aug 17 '22

Conservative Wokism has been a disease since forever. They complained about comic books and bikinis and bad language on TV.

Funny how the Trumpy moron groups that use "Woke" in every sentence don't realize what Conservatives have done in every decade. If Conservatives had their way, blacks and women still wouldn't be able to vote or hold high position jobs.

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u/skoltroll Aug 17 '22

Conservative Wokism has been a disease since forever. They complained about comic books and bikinis and bad language on TV.

In my day, that was Tipper Gore and a bunch of her wine buddies from the Ivy Leagues.

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u/rif011412 Aug 18 '22

Just as sexualty is a spectrum. People are a spectrum of conservative and progressive. Tipper Gore has done some progressive things, but obsessing over traditional values is still very much a conservative action.

Thats the scary part of the current Republican party. They are using purity tests for conservatism. They think someone like Biden is an evil socialist progressive, when clearly he is very conservative himself. Its why the national division is so fucking scary. We are already one of the most insanely conservative wealthy nations and its not enough for conservatives. They will enshrine their values with fascism before admitting people should be allowed to question tradition and authority.

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u/blindsdog Aug 17 '22

Conservative Wokism

Democrats need some kind of label like "woke" for all this conservative culture war bullshit. "Culture war" is a little too broad and has positive connotations for them.

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u/MarbleTheNeaMain Aug 17 '22

We do

we call them nazis

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u/political_og Aug 17 '22

Fascist works

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u/blindsdog Aug 17 '22

Not really. People that aren't paying attention think it's hyperbole like conservatives calling everyone communists. We need a new label for their contemporary histrionics.

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u/pinetreesgreen Aug 17 '22

The diary is about as PG as it gets. It is more a coming of age story than a war story, as i recall. There is nothing to object to in it. They'd know that if they read any of the books they try to ban. Idiots.

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u/autopsis Aug 17 '22

“Once when I was spending the night at Jacque’s, I could no longer restrain my curiosity about her body, which she’d always hidden from me and which I’d never seen. I asked her whether, as proof of our friendship, we could touch each other’s breasts. Jacque refused. I also had a terrible desire to kiss her, which I did. Every time I see a female nude, such as the Venus in my art history book, I go into ecstasy. Sometimes I find them so exquisite, I have to struggle to hold back my tears. If only I had a girlfriend!” – Anne Frank

I’m assuming conservatives object to this. They’d probably consider Anne Frank a “groomer.” At the time of publication, certain passages of her diary were removed. The unabridged version was published later.

Thousands of gay men and lesbians were sent to concentration camps during the Holocaust. Germany’s Nazi-amended criminal code, which made homosexuality a felony, wasn’t officially changed until 1994.

The Nazis used the brothels to ‘convert’ lesbians back to heterosexuality – but the women’s lives came with a ‘use by’ date, after which most of them were killed.

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u/Rogahar Aug 17 '22 edited Aug 17 '22

When we read excerpts in history class, there was only one universal reaction to that passage or any like it in the stuff we read, to whit; incessant muffled giggling at the mention of boobies.

Kids really don't give a fuck if someone's gay or not.

If reading about a gay person turned your kid gay, then your kid was always gay and just didn't know it had a name.

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u/autopsis Aug 17 '22

Exactly. I think conservative parents are freaked out by any form of curiosity, but curiosity is a totally normal thing for kids. Banning books isn’t going to magically make kids less curious. Those types of parents are obsessed with control and don’t trust their children.

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u/jovinyo Aug 17 '22

They also coddle their children awfully, but then berate "the youth" for being too sensitive, not too handy around the house, and act like PaRtIcIpAtIoN tRoPhIeS weren't their idea.

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u/MatureUsername69 Aug 17 '22

The first participation trophy was 1922 but they started becoming popular in the 60s. That's my favorite fun fact when anybody my parents age or older bitches about participation trophies.

"It started because of you pansy fucks"

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u/ghdana Aug 17 '22

Kids really don't give a fuck if someone's gay or not.

That is conservatives issue with it. They want kids to give a fuck so they can grow up and maintain the same 1940s stances on things.

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u/Rampant_Intellectual Aug 17 '22

“He’s always been Gay, he just didn’t have anyone else to be Gay with” Chris Rock

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u/Chuttaney Aug 17 '22

Let me blow your mind even more. This is age appropriate sexual curiosity. Curiosity is not necessarily an indicator of sexual preference. Many children and teens engage in age-appropriate sexual play with their peers driven by this curiosity. Even if your kid is aroused by reading this, it may be because it is new and exciting and not because it makes them gay.

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u/Rooney_Tuesday Aug 17 '22

I grew up in a conservative Christian household. When I read this part as a kid, I remember thinking “Wow, girls back then had really different friendships than we do now.” I never got the urge to ask to touch another girl’s breasts as a mark of friendship. Reading this passage didn’t turn me gay at all. If someone had been around to explain to me that this was actual sexual curiosity about the same sex, I’m fairly sure I would have just said “That’s weird but okay” and kept reading.

Conservatives have lost their damn minds.

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u/pinetreesgreen Aug 17 '22

This obviously didn't strike me as too scandalous, since I don't remember that part in her diary. Goes to show you kids only remember the bits that resonate with them personally.

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u/autopsis Aug 17 '22

Exactly. Kids don’t incorporate much of what they’re exposed to imo, unless it’s presented as forbidden, then it’s just highlighted more.

The thing is though, for a gay kid to read this could be very validating. It’s not going to turn a straight kid gay, but it might help a lonely gay kid’s mental health.

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u/Santa5511 Aug 17 '22

Did you read the edited version of it by any chance? I know growing up thats what I read in school, and parts like this were cut from it.

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u/breadfred2 Aug 17 '22

Depending on when you read it and what version, it might not have been on the version you read. Her father censored part of her diary and the full version was only released in the 90s if I remember correctly

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u/0x18 Aug 17 '22

Thousands of gay men and lesbians were sent to concentration camps during the Holocaust. Germany’s Nazi-amended criminal code, which made homosexuality a felony, wasn’t officially changed until 1994.

Fun fact: when the concentration camps were liberated they released everybody except the gays - they were just moved to a regular prison.

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u/Broken_Petite Aug 17 '22

…. Oh hell.

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u/ParanoidZooid Aug 17 '22

But she also writes about her love interest with Peter... She was so adult for a 13-15 year old, so reflective of her own growth and behaviour. School children, anyone really, would learn a lot from her forgiving, understanding, creative and optimistic nature. Even looking out at the window and seeing a tree would remind her of the power and beauty of nature, in those dark times. Truly a remarkable person.

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u/autopsis Aug 17 '22

I think she just wanted closeness and intimacy in general. Peter just happened to be there.

“My longing for someone to talk to has become so unbearable that I somehow took it into my head to select Peter for this role. You mustn’t think I’m in love with Peter because I’m not. If the van Daan’s had had a daughter instead of a son, I’d have tried to make friends with her.”

Later…

“I’m glad after all that the Van Daan’s have a son and not a daughter; my conquest could never have been so difficult, so beautiful, so good, if I had not happened to hit on someone of the opposite sex.”

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u/Vysharra Aug 17 '22

Bi people exist.

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u/DonDove Aug 17 '22

Broke my heart when I read the recently released cut parts of her diary through her father's republishing. It did make Anne more human and well, her entries feel more intruding. It was a diary after all not a journal. If Anne was gay she never got to discover it like any kid should, esp post the decriminalisation of gay orientation. And now they're trying to dehumanise trans people to the same degree.

It's alnost like the Pro-Breed sorry Life shitters came with their ideas from somewhere. Hmm.

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u/autopsis Aug 17 '22

She really was an amazing person and writer. It does seem intrusive to have the world reading her diary without her consent. But she truly made a mark on the world and lives on in our memories because of her diary at least. I think the good she accomplished by telling her story outweighs the intrusion on her privacy. It’s so sad that the world was robbed of what so many people could have contributed.

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u/DonDove Aug 17 '22

The man or woman or other even that could've created an universal cure for cancer or infinite energy like Tesla or solar powered cars that could've worked from the 60s was possibly killed in the Holocaust. The stats are too high, the probability is there.

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u/autopsis Aug 17 '22

It’s hard to imagine the world without Einstein. He fled Germany in December 1932. There was even a price on his head because of his “Jewish physics.”

But even though we lost all those potential discoveries and geniuses, I think it should be equally devastating that we lost all the small acts of kindness that the average person contributes. Even small acts have a ripple upon the world. I think just the death of one person who could have shown love to a dog or cat is a profound loss.

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u/DECtape Aug 17 '22

and now conservatives want to ban the book because of that passage because engaging with the mere existence of gay teenagers would require examining their world view even slightly, and they're lazy, stupid, hateful fascists. These are the kind of people who WILL put you in camps if only they get government support. Don't let them. Go vote.

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u/Kitsune_Scribe Aug 17 '22

There was another one, Zlata’s Diary, about a girl who grew up during the war in Sarjevo.

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u/pinetreesgreen Aug 17 '22

I have not heard about that one, dont tell the right wingers about it, they will get all flustered and "righteous".

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u/Kitsune_Scribe Aug 17 '22

It’s not as widely known, the only reason we read it in HS was because the English teacher was big on learning about current events from different parts of the world. Not just our small rural county.

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u/WendellSchadenfreude Aug 17 '22

The diary is about as PG as it gets.

It's not; you just read the PG version. Almost all students do (and have always done).

Until 1986, all editions omitted the parts where she talks about sex, masturbation, or menstruation. Some sections (again about sex, and also about her own genitalia) were first published in 1995 - and I don't think most schools ever tried to get those editions. (Also, those years were the first editions including these parts in Dutch. No idea when the first English editions included them, if ever.)

A section that includes her thoughts about prostitution and some "dirty" jokes wasn't even discovered until 2018!

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u/tim_mcmardigras Aug 17 '22

Another day, another Jeff Tiedrich tweet that I agree with, but still somehow find extremely annoying. Who the hell is this guy and does he do anything other than tweet? I swear it’s like every other post on here is from him.

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u/VILLIAMZATNER Aug 17 '22

I had the same thought a while back so I looked him up.

He has in some capacity worked in media for a long time, but from what I can tell, he's just famous for tweets.

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u/AroundTheWorldIn80Pu Aug 17 '22

I was surprised to find out he's the father of Katie Tiedrich - author of the Awkward Zombie gaming webcomic.

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u/Sadatori Aug 17 '22

Oh shit, neat

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u/wiiya Aug 17 '22

I know we’re in an echo chamber, but that guy is nothing but echos.

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u/ree_hi_hi_hi_hi Aug 17 '22

Woah woah woah, he also has curse words ad nauseam

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u/Hugs154 Aug 17 '22

Holy fucking shit

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u/skoltroll Aug 17 '22

Curse words also echo

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u/Biblical_Shrimp Aug 17 '22

I used to play D&D with a group who would insert Jeff Tiedrich-like points into the campaign... which would lead to them segueing into a real life echo chamber of points I've read word for word on reddit, or parroting the most recent John Oliver episode. Like, yeah I get it... but what are we doing here? This is just as annoying as MAGA people parroting Fox News except none of us are disagreeing with each other.

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u/thewarmpandabear Aug 17 '22

The worst is people on here conflating any complaints about how often this dude is posted with being a MAGA mole conservative. No, I actually agree with most of what he says, but it’s often incredibly pandering and lacking in depth. I also can’t help but feel that he loves the attention that he gets from these tweets, more so than being an actual activist for any cause.

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u/Funkit Aug 17 '22

Holy. Fuckin. Shit. I just hate how he posts every fucking tweet with the exact same emphasis. Get the fuck out.

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u/UnluckyHorseman Aug 17 '22

He looks like bargain bin Eric Clapton and tweets like a teenager who just discovered cursing.

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u/nothankyou821 Aug 17 '22

He has to start every tweet with “holy fucking shit.” Calm down bro lol

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u/RockdaleRooster Aug 17 '22 All-Seeing Upvote

Holy. Fucking. Shit. Raise your hand if you're tired of seeing Jeff Tiedrich tweets. Let that sink in.

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u/smb_samba Aug 17 '22

Dude used a successful tweet formula during Trump times and ran that shit straight into the ground

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u/PureBlue Aug 17 '22

Him and "jojofromjerz". These tweets never say anything of value. They're intellectual masturbation.

Feels like they're grifting the left for fame. That kind of behavior can stay on the right. The left ought to do better than this.

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u/SpaceClef Aug 17 '22

They're intellectual masturbation.

This is what it is. I dislike him the same way I dislike Neil deGrasse Tyson. I agree with most of what he says but it's just such surface level self-interested pandering. So obnoxious.

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u/AlphaCentauri4367 Aug 17 '22

Exactly how I feel about him. I usually agree with his point of view, but he seems to always have an obnoxious way of stating it. And his constant whining gets old. It's like every day he wakes up and starts planning "what can I whine about today that will get me a bunch of retweets"? I think if he ever got banned from Twitter he wouldn't know what to do with himself.

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u/braveheart18 Aug 17 '22

Because it is so obviously being boosted by bots. It's such a luke warm take on an issue that reddit overwhelmingly will agree with. There's no reason for this to be front page. That's why it's annoying.

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u/wakandan_boi Aug 17 '22

Fr this guy just sits down and tweets all day 😭😭

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u/RotenTumato Aug 17 '22

Holy fucking shit, I hate him

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u/suuubok Aug 17 '22

I remember before trump was banned from twitter this place was just screenshots of jeff tiedrich zingers that were replies to trump

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u/Grimvahl Aug 17 '22

I suspect he is retired, so he has free time for tweeting.

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u/NOLASLAW Aug 17 '22 edited Aug 17 '22

He’s a shit lib Boomer that thinks Hillary Clinton is an Avenger and most of his tweets are “Donald Trump is a pee pee poo poo fart face who golfs”

I agree with most of his tweets but god is he insufferable

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u/chazthetic Aug 17 '22

It's like they're admitting that children in other countries are stronger and less sensitive than the children in America they need to "protect" from the feel feels.

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u/mintisok Aug 17 '22

I remember having excerpts from her diary used in the "how to write a diary" class in italian primary school

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u/Bonanza-Steakhouse Aug 17 '22

Y’all should just rename this subreddit to r/jefftiedrich

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u/JunketMan Aug 17 '22

Call me crazy but America banning history books is downright censorship, which classes them in the same place as China

What a free country

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u/ceez36 Aug 17 '22

i don’t think you can compare american censorship to chinese censorship. it’s not even close.

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u/Kage9866 Aug 17 '22

It's not, but it's getting there, slowly.

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u/[deleted] Aug 17 '22

They just want to present both sides, perhaps with a book about how Anne Frank had it coming.

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u/apittsburghoriginal Aug 17 '22

Goose-stepping morons should try reading books instead of burning banning them!

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u/yerboiboba Aug 17 '22

Day 2 of saying: I have no idea who this is and at this point I'm afraid to ask. Again, I almost always agree with his statements when they pop up on Reddit... But who tf is he and why do I care about his opinion?

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u/[deleted] Aug 17 '22

The Free Speech Crowd isn’t actually supportive of Free Speech. Shocker.

The Free Speech they want is to say whatever they like with no consequences, but the rest of us must be censored.

The Right Wing Domestic Terrorists can fuck right off

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u/Kage9866 Aug 17 '22

I sure wish they would

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u/LandosMustache Aug 17 '22

The difference is that Germany is interested in avoiding Nazism in the future.

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u/derpferd Aug 17 '22

Part of me wonders that Germany is so willing to confront that part of its history because it was obliged to due to the unavoidable horror of the atrocities of the Holocaust.

And because the eye of world was on Germany after the war.

I don't know that America has yet been forced to confront the ugly truths of its history in an equally meaningful fashion. It's doubtful there'd be this much resistance to education of the horrors of that history if America were so obliged.

And America also has Hollywood and the broader media machine, which have done a great job selling the myth of America, varnishing it to make it more palatable and indulging people who would rather not confront the ugly side of how America was built.

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u/LittleRadishes Aug 17 '22

America gets away with everything. America has done some truly awful shit. Intentional torture, using soldiers as test subjects, invaded Iraq for twenty years because Saudi's attacked America, generations of human trafficking and slavery, literal genocide, meddling in other governments constantly and staging coups, denying their own people the most basic social networks that literally every other country has, and there is nothing that can convince me that America had no way to stop the Japanese other than bombing two major cities full of innocent civilians. They clearly just wanted to test out their new weapons on cities because they were bored of testing them on the ocean, islands, and their own soldiers. THAT'S NOT EVEN THE TIP OF THE ICEBERG.

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u/ElleIndieSky Aug 17 '22

The difference is, Germans are ashamed of the Nazis, while an entire American political party sees them as inspiration.

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u/amplifizzle Aug 17 '22

Holy fucking shit. This guy just curses and then recites a headline. Exact same shit every day.

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u/humbleStoicc Aug 17 '22

This guy

Who the fuck even IS this guy... ? I see him all over twitter but never bothered to google..

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u/k3rn3 Aug 17 '22

Let that sink in.

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u/Imhere4lulz Aug 17 '22

Same as that other girl that gets posted here where she recites a headline and adds holy shit because this guy may sue her for copyright if she writes holy fucking shit

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u/flt1 Aug 17 '22

Snowflakes projecting when all the flakiness, once again, are internal

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u/GreenSky2077 Aug 17 '22

Its only going to make it more popular.

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u/CasinoAccountant Aug 17 '22

Imagine being called a troglodyte by somehow who hasn't taken their eyes off their twitter feed for longer than it takes to blink since 2015

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u/Fluffy_Morning_1569 Aug 17 '22

‘Cancel culture’

Every accusation of theirs is an admission.

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u/W1nnieTh3P00h Aug 17 '22

Troglodyte is absolutely the right word for insufferable, anti-intellectual, sycophantic right wing mooks.

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u/ImnotBsianImAsian Aug 17 '22

How dare her diary entries come off as “too depressing” and “tragic.” Ok you try writing a cheerful narrative of your life as a Jew during hitler’s reign then…

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u/kovalsteven Aug 17 '22

someday they're going to ban 1984 so we can't compare this shit >.<

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u/neamerjell Aug 17 '22

Exactly! BTW, It was meant as a warning, not a fucking how-to manual!

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u/[deleted] Aug 17 '22

They banned Anne Frank?

When you go so far in one direction you circle back around

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u/unaviable Aug 17 '22

I am tired of this dudes generic takes

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u/woofsies Aug 17 '22 edited Aug 17 '22

I watched a video of Hasan reacting to a video where some dude went out and asked some zoomers some supposedly common-knowledge questions. I didn't know a lot of the answers, but some of the stuff he asked made me really worried.

Like he asked what continent are we on right now and some of them said South America and one kid even said California ahaha. If we keep cutting funding for education and sheltering the next generations we are going to be even more royally fucked than we are now. Worried for the kids and all of us.

edit: added a word

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u/Kitsune_Scribe Aug 17 '22

Have you seen the one where a student journalist interviewed students at different universities in TX about political/historical events v celebrity gossip? The only one who got all the history questions right was a poli-sci major.

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u/ortumlynx Aug 17 '22

I'm always skeptical of those videos because I feel like the creators cherry pick the answers that suit the narrative they want to push.

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u/woofsies Aug 17 '22

No, haven't seen that yet. Need to check it out, thanks!

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u/clifbarczar Aug 17 '22

I don’t think it’s a funding issue tbh.

Kids in India and China get way less funding for education but are way more informed. It’s an American culture issue.

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u/Nasars Aug 17 '22

Reminds me off the Can you name any country? video by Jimmy Kimmel.

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u/popped_tarte Aug 17 '22

Who is this Jeff guy and why do redditors keep posting his tweets?

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u/rjnd2828 Aug 17 '22

The kids can definitely handle it. It's their snowflake racist parents who can't handle it

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u/Visvalor Aug 17 '22

The Germans are ashamed of being nazis. The americans banning these books are annoyed they get shamed for being nazis.

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u/Pink_Penguin07 Aug 17 '22

I don't know what a "troglodyte" is, but it sounds like a sick burn

*edit- I googled it- someone who lives in a cave, a hermit, a person from prehistoric times

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