r/videos Jul 24 '22 Timeless Beauty 1

Black Panther: Wakanda Forever teaser Trailer

https://youtu.be/RlOB3UALvrQ
339 Upvotes

208

u/LossforNos Jul 24 '22

Martin Freeman as Daniel Craig?

32

u/dreadmouse Jul 24 '22

Glad I’m not the only one that thought this lol

7

u/SanDiablo Jul 24 '22

He actually plays a convincing badass in The Responder. He's got one of the greatest ranges of any actor.

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47

u/unique-name-9035768 Jul 24 '22

At about 1:25: Queen Ramonda says "My entire family is gone"

Does that mean Shuri bites it?

68

u/spncrmr Jul 24 '22

Could be during the blip, both Shuri and T’Challa got dusted

19

u/JeremiahWuzABullfrog Jul 24 '22

Makes sense, she didn't look older when going through the Endgame portals

18

u/NanoGeek Jul 24 '22

Endgame confirmed she was blipped. She was on the screen showing the missing heroes near the start of the film.

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33

u/dr_dialup Jul 24 '22

No idea if it's true but I read that she spouted a bunch of anti-vax shit so Disney might have forced her to bite it?

32

u/[deleted] Jul 24 '22

[deleted]

8

u/rillip Jul 24 '22

Ugh, why are people like this?

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u/timestamp_bot Approved Bot Jul 24 '22

Jump to 01:25 @ Marvel Studios’ Black Panther: Wakanda Forever | Official Teaser

Channel Name: Marvel Entertainment, Video Length: [02:12], Jump 5 secs earlier for context @01:20


Downvote me to delete malformed comments. Source Code | Suggestions

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53

u/SirGanjaSpliffington Jul 24 '22

Am I tripping or did they just show blue Avatar people in the trailer?

33

u/MulciberTenebras Jul 24 '22

In the Marvel universe, Atlanteans are also blue.

But because Namor is a mutant, he's born with a human skintone (and with those wings on his ankles).

4

u/SirGanjaSpliffington Jul 24 '22

I didn't know that. That's cool.

18

u/MulciberTenebras Jul 24 '22

Namor is technically the very first mutant in Marvel comics, since he debuted in 1939... way before the X-Men were created.

22

u/Representative_Big26 Jul 24 '22

He's not just the first mutant in Marvel comics, he's also the first CHARACTER in Marvel Comics

His first appearance was in Marvel Comics #1

8

u/pengjo Jul 24 '22

I thought it was spliced with Avatar lol but it looks like it's just another group with blue body paint i guess

2

u/TheCaptainSauce Jul 24 '22

They've taken some major creative liberties with everything Atlantean.

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34

u/notProfCharles Jul 24 '22

Is that Namor?

6

u/DesignerTex Jul 24 '22

Yes. It's been known for a while he's the "bad" guy. Played by Tenoch Huerta.

2

u/rillip Jul 24 '22

They better not have Namor be a typical MCU one and done villain.

7

u/[deleted] Jul 24 '22

Nah, long term anti hero casting. It’s going to be glorious

4

u/Cabbage_Vendor Jul 24 '22

Eh, they already ruined Ronan The Accuser, I'm not confident they won't ruin Namor.

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4

u/Interdyke Jul 24 '22

I asked myself the same thing.

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77

u/l33fty Jul 24 '22

I heard Namor can control police

29

u/MartinSchou Jul 24 '22

He can speak to fish, he can't control pigs.

10

u/qqtan36 Jul 24 '22

Fight! Fuck! Flee!

3

u/klubsanwich Jul 24 '22

Say goodbye to your precious dry land, for soon it will be wet! WET!

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117

u/expedient Jul 24 '22

NAMOR

This phase is bringing in a lot of lower-echelon characters from my 1980s childhood that I really can't wait to see -- Black Knight, Starfox, Namor, Hercules.

20

u/Kvlk2016 Jul 24 '22

Do we also get Attuma, Warlord of Atlantis?

16

u/Maxtrix07 Jul 24 '22

Whaaaat?! I don't watch trailers, but I'm so excited to hear that Namor and Hurcules are finally coming around!!

18

u/[deleted] Jul 24 '22

[deleted]

9

u/BasroilII Jul 24 '22

Curious how they are going to write Hercules. Overly serious dramatic "Shakespeare in the Park" fish out of water was Thor's thing, and That got 86'd by Taika Waititi now. Wonder if Herc will be just another comedy character.

14

u/Tempest_1 Jul 24 '22

Thor was always a comedy character.

Stamps into a pet store in Thor 1. “i NEED A HORSE”

11

u/TheSandwichMeat Jul 24 '22

"ANOTHER!" I think people forget how funny Thor 1 was because of how nothing Thor 2 is.

2

u/Platypuslord Jul 24 '22

Don't say that Thor Ragnarok was great.

-1

u/MegaBaumTV Jul 24 '22

Thor 2 was really good when it came to the royal family and their relationships. Malekith was boring but by Odin's beard, the way everyone here talks about the movie one would think it was as bad as Love&Thunder

1

u/CodnmeDuchess Jul 24 '22

Are you seriously arguing that either of first two Thor movies were better than Love & Thunder? Oooook.

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u/TRLegacy Jul 24 '22

In a different way, Thor 1 & 2 has Thor as the straight man. Thor 3 onwards has him taking things more nonchalantly.

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8

u/[deleted] Jul 24 '22

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5

u/Slendyla_IV Jul 24 '22

Me and buddy started chanting “he’s here, he’s there, he’s every fucking where, he’s Roy Kent!” In the movies after all the credits. Got a few laughs. Love Roy Kent, man.

4

u/[deleted] Jul 24 '22

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u/DAVENP0RT Jul 24 '22

When I saw that, all I could think was, "That's Roy fucking Kent."

2

u/Salarian_American Jul 24 '22

"Welcome, Roy!"

*grunt*

"Well said."

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10

u/Irishpanda1971 Jul 24 '22

Starfox is in this phase? Oh man, how the hell are they gonna handle his...problematic powers?

11

u/BustermanZero Jul 24 '22

By having him played by Harry Styles and hanging out with Pip the Troll.

5

u/Lokan Jul 24 '22

In what world are barrel rolls and somersaults problematic?

1

u/rugbyj Jul 24 '22

What problematic powers (don’t know the character)?

1

u/NanoGeek Jul 24 '22

Pheromone manipulation. You can guess where that lead.

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100

u/Foomaster512 Jul 24 '22

Need a new Kendrick soundtrack, cool to hear them use one of his songs

105

u/EMPulseKC Jul 24 '22

That transition from "No Woman, No Cry" to Kendrick was slick as hell too.

7

u/TheBigIdiotSalami Jul 24 '22

Maybe Future will debut a new voice where someone slobs on his knob

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146

u/Jaeja_Vu Jul 24 '22 Bravo!

First, Ant Man and the Wasp Quantumania now this ?? 🔥🔥

37

u/MrRyder001 Jul 24 '22

Goddamnit.

Beautifully done.

23

u/pengjo Jul 24 '22

Ant Man and the Wasp Quantumania

Found Paul Rudd's account

1

u/cjob3 Jul 24 '22

You sonofabitch, you got me.

2

u/sabatoa Jul 25 '22

I knew, still clicked it, and watched it through. hahah

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2

u/DulceEtBanana Jul 24 '22

That one is gonna be EPIC.

2

u/marialfc Jul 24 '22

I hate you 😂

0

u/iced327 Jul 24 '22

Motherfucker take your upvote

1

u/BrendenOTK Jul 24 '22

God dammit. As soon as I clicked it I knew what I fell for

1

u/DesignerTex Jul 24 '22

Hahahhahaha

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118

u/beyerch Jul 24 '22

Literally no idea what I just watched.

152

u/tekko001 Jul 24 '22

Black Panther without Black Panther.

56

u/unique-name-9035768 Jul 24 '22 edited Jul 24 '22

There's a Black Panther towards the end of the teaser.

21

u/tekko001 Jul 24 '22

Would it be a Black Pantheress?

18

u/ThePreciseClimber Jul 24 '22

I guess Pink Panther is copyrighted.

3

u/Playerhater812 Jul 24 '22

*Black Cougar

2

u/unique-name-9035768 Jul 24 '22

Could be. Doesn't really look "womanly" to me though.

9

u/10Robins Jul 24 '22

We come in all shapes and sizes. And the costume department did a fantastic job on the first BP by making the Dora look like actual warriors and not a teenage boy’s fantasy version. I feel like they would do the same here.

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1

u/mbattagl Jul 24 '22

Looked like Kilmongers gold panther suit.

6

u/Lokan Jul 24 '22

God, I'd love if Killmonger came back from another universe.

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7

u/Dan_Of_Time Jul 24 '22

I liked how the “Black Panther” part of the title was significantly smaller compared to “Wakanda Forever”.

It’s definitely a Wakanda story over anything else

10

u/cjob3 Jul 24 '22

Sony is building a whole universe of Spider-Man without Spider-Man movies. It's a shitty universe, but a universe nonetheless.

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13

u/Artrobull Jul 24 '22

people complaining trailers show to little plot. we did it, a full circle

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13

u/[deleted] Jul 24 '22

You know how teaser trailers are supposed to work right? They're teasers...

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19

u/desidude52 Jul 24 '22

99% CGI with mix of music.

9

u/ShivasLimb Jul 24 '22

Same plots. Different costumes.

2

u/Cpkrupa Jul 24 '22

Black Panther : Wakanda Forever teaser trailer

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67

u/badaccount99 Jul 24 '22

Lead actress has had an avalanche of bad press the last two years. She's not exactly The Flash, but she's still pretty toxic. She also halted production for an extended period of time.

I want this movie to be good because I really liked the first one and I'm a fan of the director, but every bit of press about it has been negative for two years.

Hopefully they prove them wrong, but I won't be going to see it opening weekend for sure.

26

u/Kingsta8 Jul 24 '22

Casting one of the dumbest actresses to play one of the smartest characters ends up being a costly mistake.

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u/atree496 Jul 24 '22

She's not the lead, at least from the trailer.

65

u/MegaBaumTV Jul 24 '22

Pretty sure that Letitia Wright could have taken over the franchise if she didn't ruin it for herself. Just don't be a toxic anti vax asshole is apparently too much to ask of her tho.

20

u/TheBigIdiotSalami Jul 24 '22

Gina Carano and letita wright really are lessons in how to fumble the bag. How difficult is it to shut up about dumb political opinions when you're on the precipice of being a household name who can sell anything? The power of being able to post is too strong

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u/badaccount99 Jul 24 '22

Disney probably read the room and knew not to show too much of her, but I'm assuming she still has a pretty large role since they shut down production for months for her when she got injured, which they wouldn't do for a minor character.

6

u/MulciberTenebras Jul 24 '22

It was too late with too much filmed to remove her from this movie... but going forward they'll more than likely recast her for the all the trouble she caused with production.

2

u/OfficialGarwood Jul 24 '22

Whilst this is very much an ensemble movie, Letitia seems to have top billing.

2

u/steinman17 Jul 25 '22

Listed first on the credit sheet

0

u/IgotUBro Jul 24 '22

She's not exactly The Flash, but she's still pretty toxic.

Whats wrong with the flash, if you mean the DC hero?

34

u/Kavbastyrd Jul 24 '22

Not the character, the actor who plays him. Ezra Miller went off the deep end in spectacular style.

11

u/IgotUBro Jul 24 '22

Oh yeah just googled him...

Dude legit went insane.

4

u/MulciberTenebras Jul 24 '22

DC tried to bury it the first time he assaulted a female fan, hoping it would blow over.

Predicably it came back to bite them in the blubber and now they're sitting on a $200 million bomb should they release it and he does something even crazier (like a confirmed rape or he freakin' murders someone).

4

u/[deleted] Jul 24 '22

[deleted]

4

u/Echo-Cell Jul 24 '22

That’s one violent trans if anything. Doesn’t changes that he’s a violent person wether he’s trans or not

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u/BrendenOTK Jul 24 '22

Don’t then know Kevin Spacey already tried that and it didn’t work

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u/themanifoldcuriosity Jul 24 '22

He means the actor who plays the character. Who has been having an interesting time lately.

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u/ykurashi Jul 24 '22

Nice of Disney to release Avatar 2 a month early!

39

u/yellowcats Jul 24 '22

I recognize some of these characters

38

u/GhostalMedia Jul 24 '22

Probably because they were the cast of $1.35 billion dollar movie that everyone and their mother saw.

10

u/groceriesN1trip Jul 24 '22

My mom didn’t watch it cuz she doesn’t like action movies

5

u/IHateEditedBgMusic Jul 24 '22

You had me on that first half

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u/GuiltIsLikeSalt Jul 24 '22

Hoping it's Nakia or Okoye in that suit... Shot at the end seems too small for M'Bako, and giving that to Shuri - despite the disconnect between medium and real life - would really sour that status after the shit the actress got up to.

3

u/acf6b Jul 24 '22

I am hoping the same but I’m kinda of hoping it goes to Shuri due to the whole tradition thing but then she determines that isn’t her path and she gives it to one of the other two, nice way of writing the character out of future things or keeping her to a minimal.

14

u/plantman01 Jul 24 '22

reminds me of that scene in terminator 2 where john connor hacks the ATM then says "easy money"

9

u/antaresiv Jul 24 '22

that's just a teaser?

9

u/IHateEditedBgMusic Jul 24 '22

Right? I really don't need to see anymore, this was enough to get me into the theatre. Sucks that we need to hype and constantly drop new information in today's marketing landscape.

6

u/[deleted] Jul 24 '22

[deleted]

3

u/DensePineapple Jul 24 '22

There's already a plot leak in r/MarvelStudiosSpoilers that matches details in the trailer.

2

u/MrDankWaffle Jul 24 '22

That leak seems much more probable.

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u/iauva Jul 24 '22

Legends never die. Chadwick Boseman is alive in our hearts

4

u/cjob3 Jul 24 '22

Rest in power, king.

-47

u/shaninegone Jul 24 '22

Cringey

17

u/A-Rusty-Cow Jul 24 '22

Cant wait for kids to find a new word

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u/nik15 Jul 24 '22

The spoilers were right.

3

u/tekko001 Jul 24 '22

Explain (To hide spoilers type >! Spoiler!< without spaces).

11

u/nik15 Jul 24 '22

Lake Bell is a scientist that is searching for vibranium in the ocean with a device that Riri made. Namor wakes up and wrecks their team. Namor asks for help from Wakanada but they refuse. He wants to kill Riri but Wakanada protects her. She has a suit but it is made out of cars. That changes to one made out of vibranium after getting to Wakanada. Atlantis vs Wakanda. Shur'is mom does. Shuri makes an artificial flower to gain Black Panther powers and the ancestral plane where she meets Killmonger. He trains her and she makes her own black panther suit. The two nations fight and Shuri beats Namor but doesn't kill him. Mbaku is now the leader of Wakanda and Nakia tells Shuri she has a son from Tchalla. Post credits, you see Doctor Doom and is hinted to be the one that sent Lake Bell and the team down to search for Vibranium in the ocean.

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u/jdbolick Jul 24 '22

I hope that this is good but I can't see how it will be possible. Chadwick Boseman was such a legend that his absence will loom over every scene. Obviously they're addressing that, I just don't see how to get past it.

7

u/Fellers Jul 24 '22

Yo that music transition is amazing.

9

u/BuckNutley Jul 24 '22

Maybe I'm in the extreme minority, but why not just recast Black Panther? It's very sad Chadwick Boseman died, but the character of Black Panther isn't Chadwick Boseman.

I got very weird vibes from this trailer. It seemed like it's a movie about a Queen of Wakanda, which is bizarre to me...nobody cares about the Queen of Wakanda, people care about the character "Black Panther", that's why the last movie was a hit.

12

u/cjob3 Jul 24 '22

well, there was a huge petetion to recast. Most people think (myself included) Chadwick would have wanted it that way. It's sad but he felt kids needed the character. Recast, then dedicate the movie in his memory.

9

u/BuckNutley Jul 24 '22

Yeah, it's very sad that he died, but he's a man and not actually Black Panther. It's weird.

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u/PixelGumTV Jul 24 '22

Cannot wait to see Winston Duke in this!

12

u/TracyMorganFreeman Jul 24 '22

I'm looking forward to Namor, and what they'll do with T'Challa being gone.

I am not looking forward to Ironheart. I didn't like her character in the comics, and Marvel's adaption of diverse "mantle passing on" characters, even the ones in the source material that were done well, has been mixed at best.

16

u/magicarnival Jul 24 '22

I'm sad they stole so much of Miles Morales's stuff and gave it to Tom Holland's Spiderman. Miles would have been awesome. At least we still have Into the Spiderverse...

1

u/[deleted] Jul 24 '22

What did they take from Morales for Holland's Spiderman?

11

u/rynshar Jul 24 '22 edited Jul 24 '22

his whole attitude, having a best friend who knows his identity. He's honestly next to nothing like Peter Parker from the comics, aside from being a good dude. Can you imagine Tom Holland spiderman doing this, for example? One of Peter Parker's attributes, especially early on but throughout his career, is he's a bit of a dick, like, pretty frequently. Miles Morales has this whole "Prove himself" thing that Parker never really had, that is SUPER present in Tom Hollands edition.

5

u/TruckMcBadass Jul 24 '22

Which version of Spider-Man was like that though? Even the comics keep rebooting their characters. I can't buy into any one idea of a character anymore.

3

u/rynshar Jul 24 '22 edited Jul 24 '22

The main one that ran from the 60s until the 2015 soft reboot, more or less. Marvel hasn't done many reboots, and the main spiderman continuity hasn't really changed many times. Sure, there are tons and tons of variants, replacement spidermen, Clones, and non-canon stories that muddy the waters, what with Ultimate, 2099, Ben Riley, and so on, but I'm talking about THE spiderman.

EDIT:
I should note that spiderman hasn't been like he is in that panel for a pretty long time - in main continuity, he's been mid-twenties for most of his publication history. He was only in high school through the first two years of his publication, and graduated college four years after that, got married in the 80s, did his postgrad, etc. He was mostly in that angsty jerk phase for those first ten years or so of publication, but that's the era that every single movie, cartoon, etc, has been of.

4

u/yognautilus Jul 24 '22

I'm not sure where you heard this from, but that's such a tiny part of Miles's character arc that it's not like they've ruined any chance of his own origin movie, especially considering all of Marvel's legacy characters had an early arc where they had to prove themselves. That's not unique to Miles at all. Miles's most defining story is how he's pulled by two different father figures: his cop dad who disapproves of vigilantes and his crook uncle, who encourages Miles to use his powers for his own good.

That, alone, would make for a fantastic movie, especially with who they already cast as his uncle. In addition, in terms of character, Holland-Peter is nothing like early Miles. Yeah, Peter proves himself in the movies, but he still goes into every battle as an annoying character who comments on everything. Even when he battles the Avengers in Civil War, Peter jokes about everything that's going on. At the beginning of his character arc, Miles battles both the guilt of being Spider-Man and his own personal lack of confidence, which shows in how he carries himself. Now the question is, could Marvel hold themselves back for just one movie and not immediately have a superhero quip as soon as they put on a mask? Who knows? But it absolutely needs to be done for Miles.

So while they borrowed a few minor things from the Miles character, it is still vastly different from Holland's Spider-Man and could easily be made into its own movie.

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u/Indie_uk Jul 24 '22

It’s just add another character to Young Avengers IMHO. Although that said with the right casting can see her being a good character (ironheart)

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u/andrewhatesyou Jul 24 '22

This shit is trash lol

2

u/blueskysahead Jul 24 '22

First one was my favorite marvel movie , excited for this one!

-4

u/SickBurnBro Jul 24 '22

Holy shit, this movie is going to be so fucking good.

-2

u/Hamzilla22 Jul 24 '22

Idk why you’re getting downvoted. But I can’t wait for this movie as well!

14

u/IllustriousEntity Jul 24 '22

Nothing pisses me off more than people looking forward to things!

2

u/rageagainsttheappeal Jul 27 '22

This post is in controversial for some reason

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u/cjob3 Jul 24 '22

so glad Angela is getting her due as an actress here. She was my dream Storm.

3

u/acf6b Jul 24 '22

She is still my dream storm, since we have the multiverse I wouldn’t mind seeing an older storm with the punk rock Mohawk and Jackman back as wolverine for a universe that has been wrecked by Sentinels.

2

u/ILOIVEI Jul 24 '22

There are going to be clips comparing this and the Avatar: The Way of Water aren’t there…

3

u/acf6b Jul 24 '22

I just want clips comparing Avatar: the way of water and Ferngully 2

-16

u/robklg159 Jul 24 '22

Okay I'm gonna say it. This looks MEH at best. It's almost guaranteed to end up being as overrated or more so than the first black panther movie and I'm not looking forward to it at all.

21

u/whiffitgood Jul 24 '22

The trailer looks pretty great imho, but it's pretty easy to infer based on all of the rest of the bland corn syrup marvel productions, this will be too.

4

u/OneOverX Jul 24 '22

This trailer was hype af

-2

u/thetruthteller Jul 24 '22

Namor come on that is cool

-2

u/skatejet1 Jul 24 '22

I can’t wait for this

2

u/garybusey42069 Jul 24 '22

And just like the first movie, no critic will dare give this a negative review.

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u/Artrock80 Jul 24 '22

Who are the blue dudes? Tie-in with Avatar?

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u/MulciberTenebras Jul 24 '22

They're the Atlanteans. Atlantis is here inspired by Mayan/Aztec culture (like Wakanda was for all manner of African cultures).

In the Marvel comics, they all have blue skin (because it was easier to make them like that in the early comics, saves money from coloring in skin by just having everything blue underwater).

Namor, being a mutant, has normal skintone and those wings on his ankles.

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u/HolyGig Jul 24 '22

I see the trolls are out in force early lmao.

Couldn't tell much from the trailer, and I agree the first one was a tad overrated, but we shall see with this one. Trailer looks pretty good

12

u/BuckNutley Jul 24 '22

Can anyone not like the look of something, or is everyone a troll who doesn't like the look of this trailer?

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u/[deleted] Jul 24 '22

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u/southofsanity06 Jul 24 '22

Definitely needed more Marvel movies. Not enough of them to be honest.

0

u/[deleted] Jul 24 '22

And the crowd goes mild

1

u/Indie_uk Jul 24 '22

Definitely getting a girl power vibe from this which I hope they do justice to and it’s strong women who are strong by their character not just the movie tropes we usually see where the writers have to throw it in your face to make sure you definitely get it. The production values look INSANE though better than most other Marvel movies I can think of.

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u/iamnosuperman123 Jul 24 '22

This trailer is a bit of a mess. I like the trend of hiding the plot but I have no idea what is going on here. Music is good though

1

u/cjob3 Jul 24 '22

You need to watch more teaser trailers. The point is to give next to nothing away. The first full trailer will have more info.

-11

u/egus Jul 24 '22

Are they doing lady black panther?

-7

u/Chalky_Cupcake Jul 24 '22

If you were walking through a jungle and encountered a female black panther i doubt you would later tell your buddies you ran into a lady black panther.

6

u/ViperAK47 Jul 24 '22

🤣 What is it you're trying to say here?

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u/jabberwockxeno Jul 24 '22 edited Jul 24 '22

I do writeups, content, and some consulting on Mesoamerican (Aztec, Maya, etc) history and archeology, so I wanted to give my input since Atlantis in this are Mesoamerican themed (and since I never got the chance to do a lot of comments back when the designs got posted a few weeks ago.

Fankly, I sort of think they did a subpar job: Fundamentally, I think this falls prey to a lot of the issues most things based on Mesoamerica do, where it's based more on other media sterotypes of Mesoamerican culture and aesthetics (and modern Concheros dancers) then anything else: Random grey pyramids in jungles, giant headdresses, primitve looking "tribal" clothing with tattoos and feathers and bone/leather ornamentation, random geometric patterns, etc. A lot of this is either entirely taken out of context and used in ways that don't fit, or were never a thing in Mesoamerica to begin with. Actual, say, Aztec cities, clothing, and art motifs can be very different. (Maya stuff is closer to the sterotype, but still is quite different in execution; whereas say Purepecha stuff is even less like it)

I'll start with Namor's design, both the normal outfit and the fancier one: I actually quite like the jade and turquioise earings/spools, and nose and chin/lip piercings: These are pretty much 1:1 to actual Mesoamerican examples, compare the earrings to these ones from the death mask of Pacal I, a king of the Maya city of Palenque. I'll also give a pass to the arm/legbands and such on the rest of his normal outfit. It's pretty generic fantasy-futristic random geometric patterns meant to evoke Mesoamerican motifs, rather then say actual Step Fret designs, but the MCU does that with everything. The big fanning chest-pectoral is again, one of those things way more common in Concheros outfits or random media depictions then actual Mesoamerican fashion. But because I don't wanna take too long typing this up and I wanna give it the benefit of the doubt, rather then critiquing the specific way it's use and shape differs (It's mixing a few different types of them from different cultures), i'll again give it a pass and just say that at least it's made from a mosiac of turquoise pieces (rather then random cloth or bone ones), which is a thing in Aztec and Central Mexican regalia, even if Jade beads would be more typical.

What I really can't give a pass is... almost anything about the fancier outfit. Now his gold ornamentation on his arms, legs, chest, etc doesn't even resemble media sterotypes and generalizations of Mesoamerican things, but if anything looks like something from Southeast Asia. The headdress is just bad. Headdresses are slapped onto everything Mesoamerica in media, but this doesn't even come close to resembling any sort of legitimate examples of them, from [actual headdresses to more helmets and headgear with feather tassels, such as seen in Central Mexico by Nahuas here (see here for Aztec vs Nahua vs Mexica as terms) or the Maya here. Some of the blue plaque pieces around his tempes, nose, and forhead do resemble some actual Maya regalia and ornamentation, though.

Beyond looking tacky, I also have issues with the Jaguar theme of the headdress, which based on what we know, seems to represent Tepeyollotl, an aspect of the Aztec god Tezcatlipoca, a deity associated with sorcery, strife, and fate's fortune and misfortune. I suspect they went with Tepeyollotl as Namor's associated god to have a big Black Panther vs Jaguar feline faceoff, but Tepeyollotl has no ties to anything aquatic in the slightest (If I REALLY wanted to stretch it I could say that Tezcatlipoca and his aspects often tempe and decieve kings into their downfall, but I don't think they did that much research). There are a ton of Mesoamerican gods they could have gone with that have ties to the water for the Atlantis theme, the most obvious being Tlaloc, the Aztec god of rain and storms. Tlaloc and other Mesoamerican rain gods like the Maya Chaac or Zapotec Cocijo actually would have been excellent choices, because it is generally thought that they all evolved out of Olmec were-jaguar gods, which is where the "fangs" and upturned snarling lips/noses Tlaloc, Chaac, etc have come from. Tlaloc and co had lost any explicit feline associations by the time he and the other 2 gods I mentioned really became a thing, but at least with a Jaguar version of Tlaloc you get that water theme, and it'd have some connection, especially since Atlantis in the movie is even named Tlalocan, after Tlaloc's realm in the Aztec afterlife.

Attuma and Namorita's designs are even worse. Again, I dig the earrings, but otherwise these are BIG on just generic primitive tribal looking elements, if you told me these outfits were reused from Apocalypto (which has severe issues and is a major example and cause of many of the mainstream media sterotypes of Mesoamerican things I mention I'd have believed you, and I mean the bad outfits from Apocalpyto (it does have some decent ones). I am not somebody who usually goes on about "cultural appropriation" or things being "problematic", but I think a comparable amount of sterotyping with negative "primitivism" connotations to, say, African cultures would get called out for that, and I don't think it's an accident that Wakanda is of course a futuristic, advanced take on African culture by contrast. It is still very normal and typical to see Mesoamerican cultures as primitive and barbaric and as "tribes" even though this is a region that had gigantic cities with planned grids, hundreds of palaces, toilets and aquaducts, etc on par with large Roman cities even during the Roman period, 1000+ years before the Aztec even existed, had complex philosophy and poetry, multi-tier appellate court systems, public schools, etc.

I also of course understand that it's not even trying to be super accurate, but you can do your own fantasy spin on Mesoamerica in a way that's well done: You just actually need to do research and understand what Mesoamerican cultures and history actually is and then tweak and twist that, so if you are deviating from it, it's for a good reason, rather then just making stuff based on, again, popular culture's misunderstandings and sterotypes of it. The game Aztez, the animated series Onyx Equinox, Mefomefo's versions of Aztec gods, etc all are examples of things that are varying degrees of fantastical and their own vision vs actually accurate but all 3 know what their doing and still respect the culture and history.

I don't think this does, but we've also only had this one trailer and some rumors, so hey, I could be wrong: I was really unimressed with Onyx Equinox's first teaser and it turned out to probably the single best job any commercial media production has done in terms of authenticity.


If you wanna learn more about Mesoamerican history, I have a chain of 3 comments here, the first talking about a bunch of different notable accomplishments, rulers, and the like, the second talking about what sources we have left and giving resources/recommendations, and the third giving an overall summarized timeline of the region.

I'd also specifically reccomend my posts here and herewhich talk more about Aztec clothing and architecture, and here which talks about Mesoamerican movies, games, comics, and artists I think do do a good job

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u/MumblingGhost Jul 24 '22

Sir this is a Wendys.

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u/_ShrugDealer_ Jul 24 '22

Bruh, you wrote an essay for a 2 minute trailer for a comic book movie that had more smash cuts than fucking Fruit Ninja. Take a fuckin breath.

7

u/Detroitdregs Jul 24 '22

Thank you for the interesting post. Very informative.

It’s a dumb comic book movie though, so I wouldn’t expect much from it and don’t think it’s really of that much consequence.

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u/Sendstorepatter Jul 24 '22

You spam this comment in a lot of subreddits but it is very poorly written.

Trim it down if you want people to read it and remove gap and filler words.

Your text is horrible.

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u/KiryusWhiteSuit Jul 24 '22

This is a comic book movie. Don't think Marvel were giving all that culture side much though back in 66. Don't look so deep into these things.
It's a movie to entertain kids and young adults, not to appease historians.

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u/TracyMorganFreeman Jul 24 '22

Yeah and yet they took the time to have 5 distinct tribes in Wakanda based on 5 different cultures in Sub Saharan Africa.

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u/fohacidal Jul 24 '22

Namor and the Atlanteans aren't even mesoamerican in the comics, I have no idea why they are like this in the movie.

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u/jabberwockxeno Jul 24 '22

Apparently it's because they wanna seperate it from Atlantis in the DC movies.

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u/elgoonties Jul 24 '22

Who asked

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u/Good_ApoIIo Jul 24 '22

Holy shit nobody cares dude.

What an essay.

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u/pokebud Jul 24 '22

Namors original outfit is as I'm sure you already know, is a guy in his underwear wearing bracelets, so this new version is basically just Namor with a fancy hat and apparently not a good quality hat after reading your post.

I do have a question I'm sure you can answer, Namor is never depicted with facial hair yet this Mesoamerican version has a sculpted beard. Why do you think that is, as I never see native peoples with facial hair.

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u/jabberwockxeno Jul 24 '22

I still think they could have done a better job in a way that still retains his comic book look, while also being a better adapation of the Mesoamerican theme: If anything something closer to actual Aztec regalia would be more minimalist relative to the very gaudy and over the top fancy outfit they went with in the film: Just do an adapatation of the diadem and have a breechloth on, no giant headdress and massive golden shoulder pauldrons.

I think people are misunderstanding my post as me being mad it's not super accurate, rather it's me pointing out that their apparent lack of research is not only not-accurate, but also means they did a poor job actually making the influences work even in the context of the MCU and the story they're trying to tell, when something a bit more informed could have worked better, even if they wanted to do a marvel fantasy take on it: Again, Tlaloc would fit the whole Atlantis plot way more the Tepeyollotl would, I think more authentic outfits would piss off comic ans less and could be closer to the designs of the actual comic Atlanteans, etc.

I do have a question I'm sure you can answer, Namor is never depicted with facial hair yet this Mesoamerican version has a sculpted beard. Why do you think that is, as I never see native peoples with facial hair.

Mesoamericans could grow facial hair, Conquistadors mention it, recorded Aztec social customs do, you see beards in some sculptures and manuscripts, etc. It was just typical for facial hair to be shaven aside from for the elderly (hence, say, huehueteotl being bearded, as he's an elderly diety) or sometimes royalty: Aztec rulers often had trimmed beards and mustaches.

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u/hamzer55 Jul 24 '22

Lol you took “akshaully”to another level

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u/sin_boy17 Jul 24 '22

😍😍😍😍

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u/SideBarParty Jul 24 '22

Essentially an advertisement for Boston

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u/Shimster Jul 24 '22

I though wakanda died?

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u/pnkfld1974 Jul 24 '22

Seems kinda racist

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u/ickle08 Jul 24 '22

Our house has watched it so many times already! And the song choice hits right in the feels!

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u/DoubleClue8 Jul 24 '22

This movie is going to be 🔥🔥🔥

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u/MulciberTenebras Jul 24 '22

No, it's going to be water.

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u/ClubAlive3508 Jul 24 '22

I know sounds odd but can’t help but notice that no woman no cry was written by a Jamaican… literally a continent away. It’s compatible I guess

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u/robertoj29 Jul 24 '22

You.. you do know Africans aren't native to Jamaica, right?

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u/Acegickmo Jul 24 '22

Yeah Jamaicans are

1

u/ClubAlive3508 Jul 24 '22 edited Jul 24 '22

Yeah I know, but so what? 'Americans' aren't native to America, but we wouldn't play god save the queen for a movie based somewhere in America right (unless sardonically)? That's my point

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u/LikeABawss22 Jul 24 '22

ur right they should play wakandan pop

2

u/ClubAlive3508 Jul 24 '22

Wakanda is in Africa right? So wouldn't it make sense to play something that's actually from Africa? It's a fair thing to point out, you guys are just being dumbasses

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u/Good_ApoIIo Jul 24 '22

Why does the trailer need to be backed by a song from Africa? Lol give it a rest.

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u/SadPenisMatinee Jul 24 '22

Dude they just played a song. Should Thor movies only play Asgardian music or black metal from Norway or some shit? They played music that fit the theme and feeling of the movie.

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u/Detroitdregs Jul 24 '22

God save the Queen and Anarchy in the UK are used in American movies and television all the time.

Songs by artists from Florida are used in shows taking place in California.

Songs from Zimbabwe are used in performances in Mali.

They’re not being dumbasses, you’re just being weird as fuck that other people don’t make the same strange and very incorrect assumption that somehow a song being from the same continent as the fictional country is some kind of natural necessity.

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u/aaliyaahson Jul 24 '22

What the fuck are you talking about? No woman, no cry isn’t the Jamaican national anthem. Who cares who sings it?

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u/ClubAlive3508 Jul 24 '22 edited Jul 24 '22

National anthem or not it’s a Marley song, who isn’t African or even close geographically. My point is, as some of you fucking idiots seem to keep missing, that it’s not remotely the same region or tone which seemed off to me considering the setting, and I didn’t care as much before, but now some of you are clearly retarded, I have to now elucidate my point yet again because you idiots are acting like I’m trying to culturally gatekeep instead of point out a fact.

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